NZTA response to question about wire rope barriers.

[eldog]

I'd love to see the Auckland turned into it's own economic entity i.e. ALL tax from Auckland stays in Auckland. Then we'd know for sure who support who.



And just for the record, I may still work in Auckland but I don't reside within the it's boundaries.

It would be an interesting exercise.
Further would be dividing it into smaller units like North, South, West and East
we could have a tax on the road/rail/planes or anything that moved through the region on entry and exit
lucky bugger living outside AKL

[MarkH]

I wouldn't say that I like WRBs, but they probably save motorcyclists lives more often than they take lives, better to NOT have a car cross the centre of the road when you are riding the other way.

It is rare to read about a motorcyclist killed by hitting a WRB, not nearly as rare as it should be to read about a motorcyclist dying after hitting something else like the one in Wellington that hit a traffic light pole.
So why does everyone get so worried about the WRBs but not seem to have a problem with trees, power poles, fence posts, etc.

[Big Dog]

How would that be taxed? I too earn in as akl.
I too live in the Waikato.
About half of my income gets spent outside akl.
Nearly a third goes to a wellington based mortgage via an akl based branch.
I could see taxing business based on geography. Individuals are a lot more complicated.

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[eldog]

Better to NOT have a car cross the centre of the road when you are riding the other way.

So why does everyone get so worried about the WRBs but not seem to have a problem with trees, power poles, fence posts, etc.

Far, far too much of a vehicle crossing the centre line and colliding with oncoming vehicle, recently.

Its this that causes barriers to be raised. Cheapest one is WRB.
What I am proposing is to make the WRB safer for motorbike riders, not just for cars and trucks etc.

Yes trees, power poles, fence posts are hazards too, something else to consider.
Have a read of the European link regarding barriers - MOI posted earlier.

[Big Dog]

I wouldn't say that I like WRBs, but they probably save motorcyclists lives more often than they take lives, better to NOT have a car cross the centre of the road when you are riding the other way.

It is rare to read about a motorcyclist killed by hitting a WRB, not nearly as rare as it should be to read about a motorcyclist dying after hitting something else like the one in Wellington that hit a traffic light pole.
So why does everyone get so worried about the WRBs but not seem to have a problem with trees, power poles, fence posts, etc.

1 is sad.
3 is a tragedy
100 is a statistic.

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[eldog]

How would that be taxed? I too earn in as akl.
I too live in the Waikato.
About half of my income gets spent outside akl.
Nearly a third goes to a wellington based mortgage via an akl based branch.
I could see taxing business based on geography. Individuals are a lot more complicated.

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Via toll tax on a person. Each time they pass a toll bridge - one for each area.
It isn't something that will happen.
It is just an exercise to see how AKL affects NZ's economy -
Does the rest of NZ really need AKL? Probably not
Does AKL need the rest of NZ? YES

we could always put a WRB around the AKL boundary and tax those who cross it and freight as well.

NZders cherish their ability to move about freely.

[swbarnett]

How would that be taxed? I too earn in as akl.
I too live in the Waikato.
About half of my income gets spent outside akl.
Nearly a third goes to a wellington based mortgage via an akl based branch.
I could see taxing business based on geography. Individuals are a lot more complicated.

In Switzerland you are taxed where you live and the money goes to your local council (only a nominal piece goes to central Government). We could have a similar system but the tax go to the council you work in (as in France, I am led to believe).

[swbarnett]

It is rare to read about a motorcyclist killed by hitting a WRB, not nearly as rare as it should be to read about a motorcyclist dying after hitting something else like the one in Wellington that hit a traffic light pole.
So why does everyone get so worried about the WRBs but not seem to have a problem with trees, power poles, fence posts, etc.

Wait until the same length of road is covered by WRBs as is covered by poles, trees etc. Then the rate will go up. At least with poles and trees here is a chance that you will go between them. Not possible with a continuous barrier.

[Big Dog]

Via toll tax on a person. Each time they pass a toll bridge - one for each area.
It isn't something that will happen.
It is just an exercise to see how AKL affects NZ's economy -
Does the rest of NZ really need AKL? Probably not
Does AKL need the rest of NZ? YES

we could always put a WRB around the AKL boundary and tax those who cross it and freight as well.

NZders cherish their ability to move about freely.

Yet you want to tax something exclusively because you say it is something we all hold dearly?

The irony is I live in the Waikato because I couldn't afford to live in akl.
I work in akl because that is where the work i do is.
In all reality I could work better from home with less costs for everyone.

That last bit is true for about 1/3 of office jobs. Yet we still clog the arteries of the concrete jungles because bosses who don't understand what we do like to see a person for the money they pay.

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[swbarnett]

Does the rest of NZ really need AKL? Probably not
Does AKL need the rest of NZ? YES

Last I heard a couple of decades ago 80% of NZs income tax came from Auckland^*. Without this I shudder to think what the roads would be like in Southland.



^*May not be true anymore, of course.

[eldog]

Yet you want to tax something exclusively because you say it is something we all hold dearly?

The irony is I live in the Waikato because I couldn't afford to live in akl.
I work in akl because that is where the work i do is.
In all reality I could work better from home with less costs for everyone.

I was putting out ideas about how we would decide if AKL needs the rest of NZ.

I am able to live in AKL where I do because I have sacrificed other things in order for that to happen. I am very fortunate in both the job I have and the home I live in. In doing a couple of 1000k trips last year made me well aware of my fortune.

My sister is doing the same for her kids - her hubby was made redundant at Xmas and is still trying to get a job, things will get tough this year for sure.

If you worked from home, you would miss the riding.
I have worked from home, it can get you down but occasionally it has it moments too.

[eldog]

In Switzerland you are taxed where you live and the money goes to your local council (only a nominal piece goes to central Government). We could have a similar system but the tax go to the council you work in (as in France, I am led to believe).

Interesting that overseas countries use this.
wonder how the locals feel about that

do they have the same geographical problems like AKL.
ie the majority of the population living in one area while the rest is mainly rural?

and do they use WRB?

[eldog]

If you're interested these are reports from Europe:EuroRap – Barriers to Change: designing safe roads for motorcyclists - 2008

and FEMA – New Standards For Road Restraint Systems for Motorcyclists - 2012

I guess if the road is safer for motorcyclists then it is safer for other road users...

Sobering reading about the number of fatalities WRB are connected too.

The cost doesn't sound like much to greatly improve safety either.

[MarkH]

It is just an exercise to see how AKL affects NZ's economy -
Does the rest of NZ really need AKL? Probably not
Does AKL need the rest of NZ? YES

"Does the rest of NZ really need AKL?"

What kind of idiotic question is this?
AKL is about 1/4 of our population, AKL is the economic & business capital of NZ, of course the rest of us need them!

[Big Dog]

"Does the rest of NZ really need AKL?"

What kind of idiotic question is this?
AKL is about 1/4 of our population, AKL is the economic & business capital of NZ, of course the rest of us need them!

Not really. We need the businesses that reside there.
But the gdp would be a lot higher for the rest of nz than for akl.
Akl uses more than it produces most years.

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